Advantages of Trading Part-Time

March 10, 2007

19:49 Huios: Hello Buffy
19:49 @Buffy2: Hi there Huios
19:49 @Buffy2: and how are you doing?
19:49 Huios: how are you?
19:49 @Buffy2: doing well here
19:49 Huios: doing well
19:49 Huios: trying to get back live trading
19:49 @Buffy2: just took way too long a nap but must of needed it
19:50 Huios: harder than I thought it would be
19:50 Huios: having issues pulling the trigger
19:51 @Buffy2: normal after being away
19:51 Huios: in live.... a piece of cake sim
19:51 @Buffy2: onetrade a day
19:51 @Buffy2: live rest can be sim
19:51 @Buffy2: does wonders usually
19:52 Huios: was actually going to do that on mon.... take one live trade... and sim the rest of the day
19:52 @Buffy2: I even did that after being away so long last fall when sick
19:52 @Buffy2: yep
19:52 @Buffy2: pressure is off
19:52 @Buffy2: makes a difference then few days trusted myself again
19:53 Huios: you mean I don't have to come back and take 20 live trades the first day? :-)
19:53 @Buffy2: lol
19:53 Huios: and have them all be winners
19:53 @Buffy2: gee you did that before??? giggle
19:53 Huios: uhhhhhhhh
19:53 Huios: no
19:53 Huios: :-)
19:54 @Buffy2: amazing how our expectation of ourselves goes up
19:54 Huios: I am so used to trading the first 2 hrs due to my schedule.... I float off to la la land after noonish
19:55 @Buffy2: depends on market for me but know what you mean
19:55 @Buffy2: so mandatory noon break
19:55 @Buffy2: your mind is used to taking it
19:56 Huios: seriously thinking of resurrecting an old rule I first had.... only trading 9:30-11:30 and 1:30-3:30... kept me out of alot of trouble
19:56 @Buffy2: sure why not
19:56 @Buffy2: rdk did something like that too
19:56 @Buffy2: many do
19:57 Huios: yeah.... really begining to see that someone can make a living off of the first 2 hrs... at least that is what the last few months have shown me....
19:57 @Buffy2: yeha once in a while it switches around but usually notfor long
19:57 Huios: and the increased volatility the last 2 weeks has been even better
19:58 Huios: right... the move happens in the afternoon... but oh well :-)
19:58 @Buffy2: some say it is here to stay
20:00 Huios: er2 has a daily sling short in the works... if it triggers, I believe it will be..... if we try for the highs again.... short choppy days are in store..... imvho :-)
20:00 @Buffy2: tks
20:01 Huios: charts.dacharts.com/2007-03-10/H__82.png
20:01 scooter5: huios the last couple years I traded in the pit I only worked the first 2 hours. one of the best decisions I ever made. lately I have been thinking of going back to only working mornings.. the mornings seem to be the best for me anyway
20:01 Huios: the bottom of the bz is just above that ma... fwiw
20:02 @Buffy2: knowing yourself is so important in this game
20:02 @Buffy2: hi scooter
20:02 Huios: the first 2 hrs I am sharp.... get bored and distracted... and do stupid things after that
20:03 scooter5: the hard thing about it is to not think of yourself as a slouch only working a couple hours a day, one of my pitfalls. But we are in this to make a living and whatever works best is what we should do , even if it is only working a few hours a day
20:03 @Buffy2: the mind is insisting on its break
20:03 scooter5: hey Buffy
20:03 @Buffy2: and one way or the other is going to take it
20:03 Huios: so what would you do with your afternoons scooter..... can't golf in 3 feet of snow... lol
20:03 @Buffy2: good pt scooter
20:04 @Buffy2: mild exercise helps get over it too
20:04 scooter5: I got so many things I could do, lists and lists of things , maybe I could put a dent in some of them
20:04 @Buffy2: lol
20:04 @Buffy2: so many are afraid of missing money
20:04 @Buffy2: missed money better than lost money
20:05 Huios: yes.... and there is alot of money to be made the first 2 hrs... esp in the er2... but in most markets i'm sure
20:05 scooter5: you have to get into a different mindset and not worry about 'missing' some trade
20:06 scooter5: sometimes I have made most of my money the first 5 minutes but I think there is still 6 more hours and I should stay. lots of time best to just take the money and go early
20:06 @Buffy2: it is a beginner mindset who still doesn'thave confidence they can sit down and trade anytime
20:06 @Buffy2: totally agree scooter hard to sit here when you get a great first trade
20:07 @Buffy2: AND stay focused
20:07 Huios: right.... I used to come home and see the move in the afternoon, if there was one.... and look at it as something I missed.... lwhen I should have been looking in the morning and seeing what I missed while I was sitting there in front of it.
20:07 @Buffy2: exactly
20:09 @Buffy2: another reason why I like the discipline numbers for feedback
20:10 Huios: a friend of mine has a daily goal... very modest.... and once he hits it he simms the rest of the day.... he has been doing that for almost 10 years.... the goal changes from time to time, and contracts change from time to time.... but it really works for him.... very consistent.
20:11 Huios: and yes.. sometimes he is done after 10 minutes
20:12 scooter5: cann't worry about missing something. I used to be so into it , one time I was helping my buddy rehab his old house and turned on cnbc and started trading over the phone from his house watching the ticker on tv. that's when I knew I had gone over the edge. lol
20:12 @Buffy2: lol
20:12 Huios: :-)
20:15 scooter5: I have 'missed' so many trades ...just cann't worry about it. one time a buddy and I went for a long liquid lunch at the stand up bar at this german place in chicago, we came back to the pit and missed when the es dropped 15 points in a couple minutes on some united airlines story. but then a month or so later there was another big move. there will always be moves in the market. gotta have balance in your life and not just trade all the time.
20:16 bigbrad: many is the time ive take 500. lunch breaks
20:17 @Buffy2: doesn't mean they don't need to be taken though bigbrad
20:17 @Buffy2: ditto here
20:17 @Buffy2: that is why the buffy leaving indicator works a lot LOL
20:17 bigbrad: a veal sandwich for 6 bucks turns into a 500 when I miss a trade
20:17 bigbrad: nuffy knows
20:17 Huios: I think another reason I am having an issue pulling the trigger... is my risk is approaching almost 5% of my account.... I had a family emergency that required a chunk of change and I drained my account.... it is much easier to risk >1%... which is what I have been doing
20:17 scooter5: lol Buffy, that indicator does work alot
20:18 @Buffy2: more than I would like scooter LOL
20:18 scooter5: hehe
20:18 bigbrad: I mean buffy knows
20:18 bigbrad: lol
20:18 bigbrad: sorry buffy
20:18 @Buffy2: np
20:19 Huios: yeah..... I like that BLI (Buffy Leaving Indicator)... unfortunately it also turns into a HLI (Huios Leaving Indicator).... :-)
20:19 @Buffy2: that doesn't help huios
20:19 @Buffy2: can't think ofit though when trading
20:19 @Buffy2: make believe it is business as usual
20:19 Huios: yeah... that is probably a bigger issure than anything.... if I want to ge honest
20:20 Huios: lots of pressure to have the first few be winners..... at least that is what I am feeling
20:20 @Buffy2: and that isn't good
20:21 @Buffy2: so turn it around
20:21 @Buffy2: look at it more as a project
20:21 scooter5: that makes it tough
20:21 @Buffy2: to inc bal
20:22 @Buffy2: whether it be by 5 bucks or 500
20:22 Huios: bty.... I am in V.... if it will be easier..... still no mic on my end, but I got ears
20:22 @Buffy2: that puts you into protect balmode which is good
20:22 scooter5: some days I start down big, like friday lol but by the end of the day I turned it all around. just gotta keep doing it by the numbers.
20:22 @Buffy2: and one trade at a time
20:23 scooter5: yep 1 at a time
20:23 Huios: I knew that the pressure wasn't good, but not sure how to turn it around into something positive
20:24 @Buffy2: can't think of anything other that what just suggested
20:24 Huios: thinkiing that reducing my targets back to 5 tic (which had a phenominal hit rate) might be the ticket?
20:24 Huios: and take it 5 tics at a time
20:24 scooter5: easy to say but hard to do but if I think about the money involved it completely messes up my head, but I still fight that demon.
20:25 @Buffy2: we all do at times scooter
20:25 Huios: yeah scooter.... I find that thinking in tics really helps with that.... at least for me
20:25 @Buffy2: I just exit
20:25 @Buffy2: when money enters head
20:26 @Buffy2: I know what it does ot my head
20:26 scooter5: I get out of a bunch at 6 ticks sometimes 5 in the er and then scale the rest . atleast I got something in the bank on the trade then
20:26 @Buffy2: and the conversation withthe market becomes one sided real fast
20:26 scooter5: yea usually with us on the wrong side Buffy
20:27 Huios: man.... ain't that the truth
20:28 scooter5: about 25 years ago or so I had a 3 day streak of losses which well I could have lived real well for quit awhile on that. the money part of it got into my head and really messed me up
20:28 scooter5: i've seen a lot of great traders mess up when their thinking goes awry
20:30 Huios: yes, and the problem with beginners, and not so beginners.... they don't even know how awry their thinking is to begin with
20:31 Huios: this is so much an internal game
20:31 Huios: a discipline game
20:31 Huios: because that is the only thing you can control... if you know what I mean
20:31 scooter5: when I started trading in the pit, I had someone getting my trading numbers everyday to see how I did. the good thing about htat was that I always knew he would be wanting to know how I did and it kept me focused on doing what I was suppose to be doing, trading the system and not just taking flyers
20:32 @Buffy2: that works well reporting to someone
20:33 @Buffy2: when I started reported to daughter
20:33 @Buffy2: sent her results everyday
20:33 scooter5: i'd go hundreds of days without a losing day, sure losing trades but not a losing day. it wasn't because I was smarter than anyone else, I just kept to the system
20:33 @Buffy2: and your so right scooter it does help
20:33 Huios: I don't know if the sling/setup will play out.... but I can recognize if it is a valid setup.... I can control my entry... and ican decide I am going to play it
20:34 @Buffy2: reporting to anyone helps and do it everyday
20:34 @Buffy2: I used to send her emails with my notes on each trade and cc myself
20:34 scooter5: 3 signal trades are the most highly profitable setup I have found, you don't get many but they sure do payoff if you have the patience to wait for them
20:34 @Buffy2: :-)
20:35 @Buffy2: some fo those 2 signal ones scream at you to play too
20:35 @Buffy2: :-)
20:37 @Buffy2: when worried about balance of acct it is easier to wait
20:37 @Buffy2: for he high odds setup imho
20:37 scooter5: when I was a newbee arbitrager , I screwed up real big huios, it happens to everyone. my boss put me in no-mans land for 3 months doing bank reconciliations and tax letters for traders and getting him his lunch and parking his car. after 3 months he asked mr if I learned my lesson and sent me back to trade . gotta stick to the rules
20:38 sportsrep3: scooter....that 3 signal trade you refer to.....is that the trade off that temp you have on dacharts?
20:38 Huios: that is one way to learn scooter..... lol
20:39 scooter5: old school huios lol
20:39 Sharon1: good discussion :-)
20:39 scooter5: 3 signal is Buffy's setup sr
20:40 @Buffy2: a reminder you have company..........
20:40 @Buffy2: he does have charts out there with it but uses 2xbline stuff
20:42 @Buffy2: the fact we can talk about it though says we aren't hiding our heads in the sand over it all but instead have dealt with it
21:03 @Buffy2: whoever you pick to report to each day doesn't have to know trading -- you have already critized yourself enough it is just the idea someoen else is going to know your results ..that helps you stay focused and check things are as you see them
21:03 Huios: but same concepts
21:03 Shar: hmmm...interesting. Thanks Huios. They're very effective. I know Buffy's template uses them, but they are so clear there.
21:04 Huios: <----- simple mind
21:04 Sharon1: what ma's does jr use?
21:04 Huios: I need a simple template
21:06 @Buffy2: maybe time for template upgrade on dacharts
21:06 Huios: they are not always so clear as in these last few charts.... nice trends show how easy trading is... heh heh heh
21:06 @Buffy2: :-)
21:07 @Buffy2: and that is what we are pd to wait for
21:07 Shar: :-)
21:07 @Buffy2: if all could wait for those would have well you know.........